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If you talk to anyone who has been a die-hard Apple user since the inception of the iPhone, you will come to learn something about them. Apple is the end-all of smartphone technology. Android users disagree entirely with that, claiming that Android-based phones are far superior, giving them more customization and features.
While that debate will rage on eternally, another fight is happening in a different technological realm, automotive. It is the battle over the electric car and the technology surrounding it, particularly battery technology.
If you have ever met a Tesla fan, you will know they are like Apple users, and many of them probably are. They admire the hard work and thought put into the Tesla vehicles by co-founder Elon Musk. They look at him as some form of tech leader that has graced their every waking moment with the hope of a better future.
The thing with Tesla owners is they are very rooted in everything about the company. They are the early adopters and will be Tesla owners for the rest of their lives, just like Apple users.
So what happens when something else comes out to challenge the status quo? What happens when another car company comes out with something that is ultimately better? We are entering a time in history where we see this happen right before our eyes. Most just do not understand it, though.
Toyota And Tesla the Apple/Android Of The Car World
Toyota motor has been around for decades longer than Tesla. Hailed often as a premium car company, Toyota is a brand that people know and trust. In my opinion, they are more like Apple, while Tesla is more like Android.
Update: After today's decision by the Japanese government Toyota has no choice but to follow Tesla or chart its own EV path.
Some of you may say this is total heresy, but hear me out. Toyota started the real EV revolution back before GM killed the EV-1. Hybrids are synonymous with Prius, just as electric cars are with Tesla. Apple gave us the first real smartphone. No, your lame Blackberry does not count. Toyota gave us the first real hybrid, which is part EV.
When Tesla entered the scene, electric cars were a neat idea, but most people thought it would fail, based on what GM had done. To me, it was like Android first starting out. Competing in a new and mostly uncharted space with competition from more prominent car companies that overlooked it.
Android, now like Tesla, has become a significant player in the market with many different Android OS brands. Apple, on the other hand, is still playing the iPhone game and sticking to it. Like Toyota, with the hybridization of their fleet, they rely on hybrids to rule the empire. All the time, watching what Tesla is doing and waiting for the opportune moment to strike, and strike hard.
Toyota And The Solid State Battery Revolution
Tesla battery day, in my eyes, was a huge success. Gaining a 56% increase in overall vehicle efficiency is absolutely astounding. Better batteries that cost less to produce and are less harmful to the environment are significant steps in complete EV adoption in the next 10 years.
As neat as battery day was for Tesla and all the fanboys (and girls), it is nothing compared to Toyota's announcement. The solid-state battery that Toyota promises to bring out next year will wipe the floor with Tesla battery tech.
Think about it. A battery that can fully charge in 10 minutes go farther is safer and better for the environment is a total no-brainer. It will destroy everything about lithium tech, no question. If there was ever a time in history where an EV revolution would take over on a massive scale, the time is now.
Tesla currently cannot produce more than 3% of what Toyota does, which also means once Toyota is at its production level, Tesla better hope they have a prayer and a fan base that will stay with them.
Why Toyota Will Succeed
I have been around many different Tesla models. I have been around many different Toyota models. Here is what I can tell you from not only my experience but that of others.
Toyota builds a better vehicle. Is Toyota a perfect car company? No, that does not exist. There are many things about Toyota that I wish were different. However, when it comes to longevity, Toyota builds a vehicle that lasts. The attention to detail with Tesla over the paint, weatherstripping, and car construction is somewhat lacking, a lot.
It is not to say that Tesla cannot build a vehicle; they simply need more time to refine their process and dial the cars in. Toyota will succeed because they have been in the game for longer than Tesla. Toyota knows the market better and has more established manufacturing facilities.
Toyota has loyal engineers and decades of research and development. Tesla does not have the resources that Toyota does and may not for quite a few more years.
Toyota will succeed because they are incredibly strategic. No move is ever made in the Toyota realm without serious time spent researching and doing a cost-benefit analysis. They are the Sensei to the Tesla apprentice.
Conclusion
When it comes to building a vehicle, I will buy a Toyota over a Tesla for the quality factor. If I plan on spending $40,000 or more on a new car, I want it to last. I think Tesla is going in the right direction but is not there yet. No one even knows why their company value is so high when they cannot even turn profits regularly.
Toyota is a company that does not do anything until they know for sure it will work. Toyota went longer than every other manufacturer before putting Lithium-Ion batteries in their hybrids. Why? Toyota believed it was not developed enough yet.
Thinking on that idea, Toyota is now rolling out a solid-state battery. This bit of knowledge tells me that Toyota has been researching this for years and kept it under wraps. They are ready to present the world with the next big thing in transportation.
Tesla may be the first car to be synonymous with EV, but Toyota is the wise Sensei who keeps showing the apprentice new things.
Until next time! Have a pleasant holiday and stay safe out there. Check out what is happening to Honda Element Owners
Check out this wild new battery tech that Tesla has and why it will forever change the auto industry.
Peter Neilson is an automotive consultant specializing in electric cars and hybrid battery technologies. He holds a Bachelor of Science in Automotive Service Technology from Weber State University. Peter can be reached on Linkedin and you can tweet him at The_hybrid_guy on Twitter. Find his page on Facebook at Certified Auto Consulting. Read more of Peter's stories at Toyota news coverage on Torque News. Search Toyota Prius Torque News for more in depth Prius coverage from our reporters.
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Comments
Articles like this are sooooo
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Articles like this are sooooo good for Tesla investors. Just keep convincing people of the next "Tesla Killer". Reminds me of gaming and the MMO era of the 00's. Every game was going to be bettet than WoW because of this or that, but when you step back you realize the amount of ground to cover to surpass these early leaders is nearly insurmountable. Tesla is mentally synonymous with EV. Like Amazon is to online shopping and WoW is to MMO's (Still #1).
Quality? Will Toyota be
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Quality? Will Toyota be making a stainless steal bullet proof beast?
The closest Toyota comes to
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The closest Toyota comes to an EV is their outrageously expensive underpowered hydrogen car, using hydrogen reformed from Brown coal. Yeah, really green Toyota. SS batteries - one of the few things less far out time wise, then hydrogen practicality.
There was a recent article
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There was a recent article with pictures, about a fellow that pulled the front bumper off his Tesla to fix the poor alignmrnt. He exposed a coolant tank that was held in place with one time use crate banding instead of a propper strap with fasteners and shimmed with a piece of synthetic corner molding like you would find in a big box store. They are not just carelessly assembled but put together with spit and. baling wire. They are not built to last but their fan boys will just look the other way. Not at all like a well built Toyota, regardless of which technology it uses. Not intersted in garbage, regardless of how high tech. This was not the first QC complaint I have seen.
Ahahahahaha! I've been saying
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Ahahahahaha! I've been saying that exact thing for a while now. That Tesla fans are exactly the same as Apple fans. Except I wouldn't say that they appreciate the meticulous engineering that goes into it. Only because they don't respect the competition. It's just popular. And people idolize popularity.
Apple people are loyal due to
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Apple people are loyal due to the “ecosystem” where the products are interlinked. Put a colander item in your iPhone and it’s also on your iPad and Mac.
Buying a 1-off does not make an ecosystem.
But IF you needed a Tesla tied into your home power system to save you money during peak rates, then yeah. Especially if Toyota required a completely different home tied system. THEN it would be Tesla vs Toyota.
Until then, you buy whatever whenever!!!
An interesting article but I
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An interesting article but I think you probably carried the analogy a little bit too far. At this point in time I don't think we're even close to knowing what the ultimate dominant path of battery development is going to be.I've seen half a dozen new technologies over the last six months one of them claiming that a chip of depleted uranium in their battery would power a car for over a million miles.
I like everyone else have absolutely no idea how this is going to end nor what the final shape of the technology and its use will be. Will everyone own an electric car or will it become a communal type of thing where you simply call up the car for your use as you need it.
So we'll have to see. The one thing I believe is absolutely true is that the internal combustion engine which let's face it is a very old and inefficient technology and one that pollutes the Earth mercilessly is on its way out. Those countries who depend on the sale of fossil fuels for their economic sustenance are in very big trouble.
Toyota is a joke. They are
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Toyota is a joke. They are shooting blanks at a steamtrain about to hit them.They have nothing in stock that can save them from bankruptcy in 5 years from now.
why wouldn't these new
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why wouldn't these new batteries work in toyotas own hybrids? how bout because it's vaporware
Talk to me when Toyota is
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Talk to me when Toyota is able to mass produce a solid state battery. Battery day wasn’t about some major battery tech breakthrough it was about DFM.
I am still not sure what to
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I am still not sure what to think of it after reading the entire article. The only reference the author gave was to a broken link to Toyota's announcement from a year ago.
"As neat as battery day was for Tesla and all the fanboys (and girls), it is nothing compared to Toyota's announcement. The solid-state battery that Toyota promises to bring out next year will wipe the floor with Tesla battery tech."
Really? a year ago. That is decades in the EV market. Tesla started 3 giga factories which are in different stages between then and now. What did Toyota do in regards to batteries since Dec 2019? Probably nothing that is in production.
I have great respect for Toyota and loved my Lexus, which is a fantastically built car. But, the scale at which Musk is deploying his tools and raising cheap money to build a behemoth is something that the old "cost analysis" companies are not able to comprehend.
The Tesla valuation doesn't make any sense at all for normal value based thinking as you can't imagine a company that is trying to build 0.5 million cars in a year is valued more than the top 10 car manufacturers combined.
Saying the Toyota battery that doesn't exist will crush the Tesla battery that exists is just plain heresy. Probably on par for 2020 year we had in the US.
Some reality here. Toyota
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Some reality here. Toyota will have a "prototype" battery in 2021 with a car that you can buy in the "early 2020s". A few moths back Toyota said that was 2024. So you won't be buying a Toyota with the new battery in 2021, 2022 and probably not in 2023.
In the Mean time. Tesla 4680 battery Also has a dry electrolyte. It will have 54% greater energy density than Their 2170 which will allow:
520 plus mile range on MS Plaid (EPA) - not 500KM (316mi).
.... and this does not hit the limit on the tech.
1.54* Model S range = 1,000KM = 625Mi
1.54* Model 3 range = just under 800KM = 495Mi
MS Plaid @520+ will be available to BUY in 2021
The others from 2022 (when they expect to have 100GWH of production by EOY... going into large scale production... not prototypes.
Toyota's claim of 2x energy density of (who's battery?).
Sounds alot like Maxwell claim of 500kwh/kg (300 already passed over a year ago)
Tesla tech is in the 350+KWH/KG range with 4680 but Maxwell always noted that it can ramp to 500KWH/KG... that hasn't changed and with 4 years... it seems likely that it will easily match the Toyota battery.
So the only news here is that Toyota aspires to sell cars in 2024 that Tesla will be selling in 2022... with someone else's autopilot.
As for quality - of late, this been about paint and simple panel alignment (not the actual stamping of the parts). Battery and motors both rated at >1M miles with body designed for commercial use (even the M3/MY).
2021 will see the new tech Berlin paint shop.
2021 will also see a similar paint shop in Austin.
2022-2024 at all locations.
That should eliminate the primary remaining quality issue.
Front and Back full casts and 4680 battery/frame at both.
So what will be left that Toyota can lay claim to in 2024 when they produce their car?
By then Tesla will be producing about 3 million EVs/year by then - compared to ?? EVs at Toyota?
... and we have no idea what price point Toyota can manage on these batteries. We do know the 4680 is Much cheaper than 2170 Tesla already uses.
Who is the sensei and who is the student?
This article was written by a
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This article was written by a non-engineer.
1) A hybrid is NOT an EV. Toyota made one EV and it was a RAV4 on a Tesla power train.
2) Toyota has made claims, but as of today no solid state battery exists to the scale of vehicle propulsion
3) Solid state lithium batteries are not just a year away, not to mention their very poor performance in the cold!
4) Claiming Toyota will beat Tesla because of “they’ve been around longer” is a horrible argument. Have you seen Ford, GM, Honda, BMW, or Mercedes create a better EV than Tesla? No, because EVs are an entirely new technology.
5) In the poor excuse for a conclusion, the argument is Toyota makes lasting vehicles and have a lot of engineers. Both poor arguments. They argument here is about the electric powertrain. Toyota does not have have battery engineers and nor do they have any experience with a full EV.
Poorly written article with little to no substance. Toyota’s announcement means nothing without some evidence.
All talk!
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All talk!
I think most Tesla owners are
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I think most Tesla owners are like me, we aren’t really married to anyone brand I’m more loyal to the idea of hydrocarbon free transportation than Tesla, if someone comes out with a better vehicle I will give it a chance I don’t care who makes it. On the other hand any great leap in battery technology will be temporary, Tesla and other car makers will catch up or perhaps even exceed any new breakthrough technology.
Tesla will remain the least
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Tesla will remain the least reliable, and most problematic vehicle, as long as the its servicing infrastructure remains unchanged and the company insiders remain oblivious of the American Driver Demands. It is not in the league of any of the giant Automakers. So please spare me the BS about an idea-became realty due to the need, not to innovation that was introduced half ass.
What is similar about these
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What is similar about these different companies? Both make ugly cars. Toyota hybrids are joke. Nice to see how bad their ev's will be.
Tesla is not like android.
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Tesla is not like android. Many android phones you can change the battery, change the screen, etc. Tesla is totally like apple. You cannot repair it yourself. My Toyota on the other hand, can be repaired by myself or the local garage. This is where Tesla fails as folks like myself who live in rural areas have no access to repair or maintenance on such tech, unlike Toyota. Saying that, I like Tesla but it's like buying a beta version of something as it seems that Tesla is expanding into different models too quickly without solving some of the problems with it's older models(just google Tesla problems). Full disclosure, I am now on my third Toyota, the last one I bought brand new. If they get solid state batteries, not much Tesla can do to pull me over. They need a bigger and better customer service and maintenance division. Without proper and timely support Toyota is gonna kill them as they have customer service down pat.
Keeping with tradition, every
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Keeping with tradition, every month or so some new or legacy auto manufacturer is "Going to be a Tesla Killer". Porsche, Jaguar, VW, Lucid, Nikola etc, etc, etc. So Toyota, I ask you where is your charging network? Your millions of miles of FSD data? Just a couple months ago your CEO said Tesla was a boutique player and electric cars aren't serious contenders. With that leadership direction there's NO comparison. Sit down, shut up, and hold on. Because here comes Tesla Semi, Cyber Truck and Roadster 2.0
Car buying is not all
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In reply to Keeping with tradition, every by Noidle (not verified)
Car buying is not all rational. I was a very early adopter of Model S. I had it for almost 8 years, and just sold it 2 weeks ago (before the warranty expires). I now need a change, and there are too many teslas in California. So, after some analysis, I found my next car: Polestar-2. I test drove it yesterday (they bring it your house). Model S has placed a high bar, but I was super impressed by Polestar-2. It looks great, and it drives great. And the car quality is top notch. I think this is the closest to tesla among all the other vendors. It does lack some tesla features, but I am going to buy the Polestar-2.
Just make it affordable.
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Just make it affordable.
This guy is just a Toyota boy
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This guy is just a Toyota boy...
I hope Toyotas claims are
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I hope Toyotas claims are true and they do have an EV out in the next few years. We currently have a Tesla Model S and a reservation on a Cybertruck. The more the better when it comes to EV's. Competition will drive improvement across the board.
lol yeah, no it won't. Your
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lol yeah, no it won't. Your story claims this will be launched in 2021. Nope. That's their prototype. 2025 is limited production. Tesla's 4680's already have <15min charging, will be produced in 2021/2022, and will likely have $50/kWh cost. Sorry but solid state is a pipe dream.
electric cars were around in
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electric cars were around in the late 1800's. The first cop car was electric and the first speeding ticket was served to a driver of an electric car. The oil industry probably had something to do with steam and electric cars being forgotten.
> Toyota is a company that
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> Toyota is a company that does not do anything until they know for sure it will work.
Except when they don't... Mirai , their fool cell cars...
I was a very early adopter of
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I was a very early adopter of Tesla. I had the Model S for almost 8 years, and just sold it 2 weeks ago (before my warranty runs out). It was a beautiful car. I am now almost certain to buy Polestar-2. I did a test drive yesterday (they pick you up at your home), and it was a great driving experience. And it looks great. Model S placed a high bar, but I am very pleased with Polestar-2. What I want to say is that there is a reason there are so many cars vendors. People have different tastes, and car buying reflects that. So, superior battery or not, the Polestar-2 looks very very compelling to me.
Tesla built the Prius battery
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Tesla built the Prius battery because Toyota couldn't.
Tesla built the Prius battery
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Tesla built the Prius battery because Toyota couldn't.
Yes, Toyota has been playing
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Yes, Toyota has been playing in the Hybrid market for a long time, but has not truely updated the Prius car since it was first introduced. They are a large slow moving company who take too long to change technologies. Yes, their cars last along time, but they have similar number of recalls like all car manufacturers.
If this battery tech is as good as they say it is, then they might have an edge on other companies in the short term, but everyone catches up over time, and these days that can be just a few months difference!
Reuters came out with an article about Apple and the chance that they will be jumping into the car manufacturing business last week.
Just because you can product phones, etc does not mean that you can do the same thing in the car industry! Yes, Apple has deep pockets, but throwing 10's of billions of $$ at a car where the margins are 100x smaller than that of phones is a huge risk, and one that the shareholders might not want to wander into .. knowing what they are used too!!
If anything, I see them entering the autonomous car share business like waymo. It will be run like a service which is Apple main bread and butter these days ..